AN INTERVIEW WITH NICOLE BARRAZA MARIN HODGES
Earlier this month, teachers at all six Citizens of the World charter schools in Los Angeles voted overwhelmingly to unionize with United Teachers Los Angeles. Jacobin spoke to two teachers about the organizing drive.
A teacher greets her class during the first day of school in California on August 11, 2022. (Paul Bersebach / MediaNews Group / Orange County Register via Getty Images)
INTERVIEW BYSARA WEXLER
06.26.2024
JACOBIN
On June 12, United Teachers Los Angeles (UTLA) announced that teachers at all six schools in the Citizens of the World Charter School network voted overwhelmingly to unionize. The teachers, who backed the union with 90 percent support, are unionizing as the Citizens of the World Charter (CWC) Educators United local of UTLA.
Citizens of the World teachers join a small segment of unionized charter-school teachers, who represent about 11 percent of all teachers employed by charters. The win is significant because if unions were to succeed in growing their presence in charter schools more broadly, it would mean a major blow to charter boosters’ decades-long effort to undermine teachers’ unions. Jacobin contributor Sara Wexler spoke to two Citizens of the World teachers about their organizing drive and why they decided to unionize.
SARA WEXLER
What sparked the decision to unionize?
MARIN HODGES
The educators at Citizens of the World, Los Angeles, care deeply about our students and our mission, but teachers’ voices have not always been central to our decision-making process. So while teachers have attempted to advocate for themselves in the past, we’ve seen little meaningful change because of the top-down structure of our organization. Having a union will give teachers more input in decisions that are affecting them directly, which will make our school a more positive environment for both educators and our students.
NICOLE BARRAZA
It feels like we don’t have an equal stake when it comes to our voices being heard and decisions being made. I personally feel frustrated by that because we are the ones that the decisions and policies affect the most, along with our students. It’s really important that we are able to have a say in how things are run at our schools, because we know firsthand what’s going to help our conditions for our students.
SARA WEXLER
Do you have specific examples of your voices not being heard, or policies or conditions that you would have liked to have input on?
NICOLE BARRAZA
There are two specific things recently. One is our changing salary table, which is a very different structure than what it has been in the past. On the new salary table that Citizens of the World approved, educational experience [i.e., relevant college or graduate coursework] does not carry as much weight anymore; it’s more about how many years you’ve taught. That in itself I was not very excited about, but also, the new salary scale got approved rather quickly. I know there were lots of teachers who were at the board meetings voicing their concerns about it. I worry about retention of staff, because the longer someone has been teaching, [the better they are typically] able to serve our students.
The other thing is, Citizens of the World had been talking about changing our special-education program and the type of support we need. It feels as though they’re going to be cutting back, and that is something that I feel we need more support in typically. Being on the ground as a teacher, I see the needs more clearly than people who are in the regional support office do.
SARA WEXLER
Can you give me a timeline of the organizing for the union? When did the organizing begin, and what did the lead-up to the vote look like?
MARIN HODGES
Educators at Citizens of the World Los Angeles have been discussing unionizing for much longer than I have been a part of the organization. But the conversations have really ramped up over the past few months, starting around April when we were presented with the opportunity to work with United Teachers Los Angeles.Once we were confident that we had a supermajority of over 85 percent of our educators on board, we introduced the official petition to join UTLA.
NICOLE BARRAZA
From what I know, teachers have been talking about this for years. Changes like the salary table [adjustment], I think, prompted us to mobilize more quickly.
SARA WEXLER
How exactly did you go about organizing?
MARIN HODGES
There were representatives across each of the campuses who started having conversations with each of our individual educators to see where people were at. Once we were confident that we had a supermajority of over 85 percent of our educators on board, we introduced the official petition to join UTLA.
NICOLE BARRAZA
I came on a little bit later. I feel like it was trickling throughout the teachers, the conversations. . . . One of the representatives at my school was trying to tackle those conversations with other educators one-on-one, to share the information and what we needed in order to unionize. That felt like a little bit of a slow process because we were trying to be discreet about it and make sure that everybody felt like they knew what was going on in those one-on-one conversations.
When I was brought in at our campus specifically — we’re three floors, and the main person who was organizing at our campus was on the first floor. She was friendly with the first- and second-floor people, but didn’t know anyone on the third floor that well. So that became my torch to bear, to pass it on to the upper-grade teachers who I had a relationship with.
SARA WEXLER
Did you face any challenges or obstacles, whether that was convincing other teachers or overcoming resistance from school administration?
NICOLE BARRAZA
Again, we had over 90 percent of educators sign the petition, we do have a very high level of support among our teachers. I think the only reticence I faced was that some teachers might have felt a little bit scared, because it is a change.
But so many of us were on board. And for various reasons: each teacher has had some sort of dissatisfaction somewhere. Again, whether it was the salary table or changes in special education, there are things that we know could be improved or done in a different way. So even teachers who were a little like, “I’m not sure about signing” were still expressing their verbal support for us — at least the teachers I talked to. Even if we didn’t get their signatures, they still were like, “I want to be kept in the loop, and I want to see where it goes; I want to be involved more in the future. I’m just maybe not ready right now.”
At my campus, my administration has not made any comment to us yet. I don’t know exactly how they feel or if they will be an obstacle. Similarly, there are some parents who have shown support at my campus, but I haven’t received much negative feedback.
MARIN HODGES
We didn’t receive much pushback from educators. Almost everybody was on board.
I think we love our school; we all care about making our organization a better place. I would agree that there was a little bit of fear or hesitation from some educators because we don’t always associate charter schools with unions. But I think reminding them that this particular union [UTLA] represents over a thousand charter educators at nine different schools across Los Angeles was helpful. And emphasizing the supermajority — that we had over 90 percent of educators that were on the same page and that we are all stronger together — was important in having those discussions with people who were a little more hesitant.
SARA WEXLER
You have previously taught at schools that did have unions in the past. Did you sense differences coming into a charter school without a union in the work environment?
NICOLE BARRAZA
I love Citizens of the World Charter, and I decided to work there despite there not being a union. Every time I’ve been at a school that has a union, I think I felt a little more at ease. You just feel a little more protected. So when there were talks about starting a union here, to me it was a no-brainer: of course I would love to be a part of a union.
For me, the draw of Citizens of the World was based on other things. We were very focused on diversity and inclusion, on social justice education for students, and social emotional learning. We’re encouraged and expected to be teaching those topics to our students. And that is the type of school I was looking for.
Even though there was no union, and I knew I would be getting a pay cut from where I was before, those were such big draws to me that it didn’t really matter. I was willing to take that hit.
But there are things for which it is nice to have that union representation. Not having a contract is something that can feel challenging at a charter school; you don’t know what’s going to happen year to year.Not having a contract is something that can feel challenging at a charter school; you don’t know what’s going to happen year to year.
I had an issue with my offer letter this past year, and it all got worked out. But I had to have a meeting with someone in our regional support office, and I remember feeling like this is something that a union rep would help me with. I was feeling like I don’t have anyone to turn to — I can’t really ask my administration for help. It was a small instance where I was like, man, this is what a union is for, for those tough conversations and that protection, and that extra voice and support in those rooms.
So it does feel different being here, and I’m hopeful that as our union grows and continues and we’re able to successfully get a contract with our employer, everybody will feel that across the board. I hope that all our educators at our school feel more at ease and confident with themselves and their jobs.
SARA WEXLER
You’re going into bargaining soon. What do you think your main demands will be at the bargaining table?
MARIN HODGES
Our charter includes seven different campuses across five different regions. We all have our own unique communities that we serve and our own unique needs. In the fall, we will start the process of soliciting input from our educators to make sure that we are representative of all the needs that we see across all of our campuses.
Some of the things that have come up in conversation already have been smaller class sizes, smaller caseloads for our special education teachers, more teaching assistants [TAs] in our classrooms, more funding for our arts programs. So a wide variety of issues that we will definitely tailor down once we start having more specific conversations with the educators we are representing.
SARA WEXLER
How do you imagine a union changing your experience at your workplace?
NICOLE BARRAZA
My hope is that it will make our teaching more sustainable. It’s not a secret that nationwide, teaching is just not a very sustainable job. Things like lower class sizes, extra support in the form of teaching assistants — all those things can help make your job as a teacher more manageable and can improve the learning experience for our students.
To me, creating an environment where teachers feel supported, where the job can be done for a long time, is the goal. But [improving] those working conditions for our teachers is what is best for the students as well, because a thriving teacher is going to have thriving students.
MARIN HODGES
Citizens of the World attracts some really incredible people. I love the people that I work with. They all care deeply about our school and about our students, but the workload is unsustainable at times. I’m hoping that having a union will help us with teacher retention so that we can recruit and retain amazing educators across Los Angeles, which will ultimately help our students.
SARA WEXLER
Do you mind saying more about your working conditions, like the heavy workload you just mentioned?
MARIN HODGES
From a middle-school perspective, taking away TAs puts that responsibility back on the lead teacher, meaning that we might not be able to provide as much support for our students, especially those who really need the extra help. Adding additional classes for teachers, additional grade levels from year to year — so maybe one year you’re teaching eighth grade, and the next year you have to teach eighth and seventh grade. Larger caseloads for our special education teachers is also a big concern: they’re adding more and more students every year.
NICOLE BARRAZA
Generally, in education, there’s always a million things to do, and we have little prep time. That’s another thing we didn’t mention: our specialist time, which is our planning time, has been shortening.That workload is very time-consuming. And I don’t mean time-consuming in the constraints of my work hours — I mean outside of my work hours it’s a lot.
I’m trying to think of how to explain the demands of teaching in a sound bite. You’re on for seven hours a day with your students. Every decision in the classroom is for them. One way I’ve seen it explained is: you’re presenting a seven-hour meeting, and then after that you have to use your own time to plan for that, in addition to meetings and trainings and miscellaneous things that pop up.
That workload is very time-consuming. And I don’t mean time-consuming in the constraints of my work hours — I mean outside of my work hours it’s a lot.
Having those extra supports, even little things like having a teaching assistant, even for part of the day, makes a huge difference. Because they can help manage the classroom; they can help you run small groups. They can help a lot with social-emotional needs of the students that you, as the one adult in the room, can’t always get to, or that are challenging to get to.
I envision a better world for our teachers. In general, we need more support. And I am hopeful that this union for our school can be a step in the right direction to give teachers the support that they need.
On June 12, United Teachers Los Angeles (UTLA) announced that teachers at all six schools in the Citizens of the World Charter School network voted overwhelmingly to unionize. The teachers, who backed the union with 90 percent support, are unionizing as the Citizens of the World Charter (CWC) Educators United local of UTLA.
Citizens of the World teachers join a small segment of unionized charter-school teachers, who represent about 11 percent of all teachers employed by charters. The win is significant because if unions were to succeed in growing their presence in charter schools more broadly, it would mean a major blow to charter boosters’ decades-long effort to undermine teachers’ unions. Jacobin contributor Sara Wexler spoke to two Citizens of the World teachers about their organizing drive and why they decided to unionize.
SARA WEXLER
What sparked the decision to unionize?
MARIN HODGES
The educators at Citizens of the World, Los Angeles, care deeply about our students and our mission, but teachers’ voices have not always been central to our decision-making process. So while teachers have attempted to advocate for themselves in the past, we’ve seen little meaningful change because of the top-down structure of our organization. Having a union will give teachers more input in decisions that are affecting them directly, which will make our school a more positive environment for both educators and our students.
NICOLE BARRAZA
It feels like we don’t have an equal stake when it comes to our voices being heard and decisions being made. I personally feel frustrated by that because we are the ones that the decisions and policies affect the most, along with our students. It’s really important that we are able to have a say in how things are run at our schools, because we know firsthand what’s going to help our conditions for our students.
SARA WEXLER
Do you have specific examples of your voices not being heard, or policies or conditions that you would have liked to have input on?
NICOLE BARRAZA
There are two specific things recently. One is our changing salary table, which is a very different structure than what it has been in the past. On the new salary table that Citizens of the World approved, educational experience [i.e., relevant college or graduate coursework] does not carry as much weight anymore; it’s more about how many years you’ve taught. That in itself I was not very excited about, but also, the new salary scale got approved rather quickly. I know there were lots of teachers who were at the board meetings voicing their concerns about it. I worry about retention of staff, because the longer someone has been teaching, [the better they are typically] able to serve our students.
The other thing is, Citizens of the World had been talking about changing our special-education program and the type of support we need. It feels as though they’re going to be cutting back, and that is something that I feel we need more support in typically. Being on the ground as a teacher, I see the needs more clearly than people who are in the regional support office do.
SARA WEXLER
Can you give me a timeline of the organizing for the union? When did the organizing begin, and what did the lead-up to the vote look like?
MARIN HODGES
Educators at Citizens of the World Los Angeles have been discussing unionizing for much longer than I have been a part of the organization. But the conversations have really ramped up over the past few months, starting around April when we were presented with the opportunity to work with United Teachers Los Angeles.Once we were confident that we had a supermajority of over 85 percent of our educators on board, we introduced the official petition to join UTLA.
NICOLE BARRAZA
From what I know, teachers have been talking about this for years. Changes like the salary table [adjustment], I think, prompted us to mobilize more quickly.
SARA WEXLER
How exactly did you go about organizing?
MARIN HODGES
There were representatives across each of the campuses who started having conversations with each of our individual educators to see where people were at. Once we were confident that we had a supermajority of over 85 percent of our educators on board, we introduced the official petition to join UTLA.
NICOLE BARRAZA
I came on a little bit later. I feel like it was trickling throughout the teachers, the conversations. . . . One of the representatives at my school was trying to tackle those conversations with other educators one-on-one, to share the information and what we needed in order to unionize. That felt like a little bit of a slow process because we were trying to be discreet about it and make sure that everybody felt like they knew what was going on in those one-on-one conversations.
When I was brought in at our campus specifically — we’re three floors, and the main person who was organizing at our campus was on the first floor. She was friendly with the first- and second-floor people, but didn’t know anyone on the third floor that well. So that became my torch to bear, to pass it on to the upper-grade teachers who I had a relationship with.
SARA WEXLER
Did you face any challenges or obstacles, whether that was convincing other teachers or overcoming resistance from school administration?
NICOLE BARRAZA
Again, we had over 90 percent of educators sign the petition, we do have a very high level of support among our teachers. I think the only reticence I faced was that some teachers might have felt a little bit scared, because it is a change.
But so many of us were on board. And for various reasons: each teacher has had some sort of dissatisfaction somewhere. Again, whether it was the salary table or changes in special education, there are things that we know could be improved or done in a different way. So even teachers who were a little like, “I’m not sure about signing” were still expressing their verbal support for us — at least the teachers I talked to. Even if we didn’t get their signatures, they still were like, “I want to be kept in the loop, and I want to see where it goes; I want to be involved more in the future. I’m just maybe not ready right now.”
At my campus, my administration has not made any comment to us yet. I don’t know exactly how they feel or if they will be an obstacle. Similarly, there are some parents who have shown support at my campus, but I haven’t received much negative feedback.
MARIN HODGES
We didn’t receive much pushback from educators. Almost everybody was on board.
I think we love our school; we all care about making our organization a better place. I would agree that there was a little bit of fear or hesitation from some educators because we don’t always associate charter schools with unions. But I think reminding them that this particular union [UTLA] represents over a thousand charter educators at nine different schools across Los Angeles was helpful. And emphasizing the supermajority — that we had over 90 percent of educators that were on the same page and that we are all stronger together — was important in having those discussions with people who were a little more hesitant.
SARA WEXLER
You have previously taught at schools that did have unions in the past. Did you sense differences coming into a charter school without a union in the work environment?
NICOLE BARRAZA
I love Citizens of the World Charter, and I decided to work there despite there not being a union. Every time I’ve been at a school that has a union, I think I felt a little more at ease. You just feel a little more protected. So when there were talks about starting a union here, to me it was a no-brainer: of course I would love to be a part of a union.
For me, the draw of Citizens of the World was based on other things. We were very focused on diversity and inclusion, on social justice education for students, and social emotional learning. We’re encouraged and expected to be teaching those topics to our students. And that is the type of school I was looking for.
Even though there was no union, and I knew I would be getting a pay cut from where I was before, those were such big draws to me that it didn’t really matter. I was willing to take that hit.
But there are things for which it is nice to have that union representation. Not having a contract is something that can feel challenging at a charter school; you don’t know what’s going to happen year to year.Not having a contract is something that can feel challenging at a charter school; you don’t know what’s going to happen year to year.
I had an issue with my offer letter this past year, and it all got worked out. But I had to have a meeting with someone in our regional support office, and I remember feeling like this is something that a union rep would help me with. I was feeling like I don’t have anyone to turn to — I can’t really ask my administration for help. It was a small instance where I was like, man, this is what a union is for, for those tough conversations and that protection, and that extra voice and support in those rooms.
So it does feel different being here, and I’m hopeful that as our union grows and continues and we’re able to successfully get a contract with our employer, everybody will feel that across the board. I hope that all our educators at our school feel more at ease and confident with themselves and their jobs.
SARA WEXLER
You’re going into bargaining soon. What do you think your main demands will be at the bargaining table?
MARIN HODGES
Our charter includes seven different campuses across five different regions. We all have our own unique communities that we serve and our own unique needs. In the fall, we will start the process of soliciting input from our educators to make sure that we are representative of all the needs that we see across all of our campuses.
Some of the things that have come up in conversation already have been smaller class sizes, smaller caseloads for our special education teachers, more teaching assistants [TAs] in our classrooms, more funding for our arts programs. So a wide variety of issues that we will definitely tailor down once we start having more specific conversations with the educators we are representing.
SARA WEXLER
How do you imagine a union changing your experience at your workplace?
NICOLE BARRAZA
My hope is that it will make our teaching more sustainable. It’s not a secret that nationwide, teaching is just not a very sustainable job. Things like lower class sizes, extra support in the form of teaching assistants — all those things can help make your job as a teacher more manageable and can improve the learning experience for our students.
To me, creating an environment where teachers feel supported, where the job can be done for a long time, is the goal. But [improving] those working conditions for our teachers is what is best for the students as well, because a thriving teacher is going to have thriving students.
MARIN HODGES
Citizens of the World attracts some really incredible people. I love the people that I work with. They all care deeply about our school and about our students, but the workload is unsustainable at times. I’m hoping that having a union will help us with teacher retention so that we can recruit and retain amazing educators across Los Angeles, which will ultimately help our students.
SARA WEXLER
Do you mind saying more about your working conditions, like the heavy workload you just mentioned?
MARIN HODGES
From a middle-school perspective, taking away TAs puts that responsibility back on the lead teacher, meaning that we might not be able to provide as much support for our students, especially those who really need the extra help. Adding additional classes for teachers, additional grade levels from year to year — so maybe one year you’re teaching eighth grade, and the next year you have to teach eighth and seventh grade. Larger caseloads for our special education teachers is also a big concern: they’re adding more and more students every year.
NICOLE BARRAZA
Generally, in education, there’s always a million things to do, and we have little prep time. That’s another thing we didn’t mention: our specialist time, which is our planning time, has been shortening.That workload is very time-consuming. And I don’t mean time-consuming in the constraints of my work hours — I mean outside of my work hours it’s a lot.
I’m trying to think of how to explain the demands of teaching in a sound bite. You’re on for seven hours a day with your students. Every decision in the classroom is for them. One way I’ve seen it explained is: you’re presenting a seven-hour meeting, and then after that you have to use your own time to plan for that, in addition to meetings and trainings and miscellaneous things that pop up.
That workload is very time-consuming. And I don’t mean time-consuming in the constraints of my work hours — I mean outside of my work hours it’s a lot.
Having those extra supports, even little things like having a teaching assistant, even for part of the day, makes a huge difference. Because they can help manage the classroom; they can help you run small groups. They can help a lot with social-emotional needs of the students that you, as the one adult in the room, can’t always get to, or that are challenging to get to.
I envision a better world for our teachers. In general, we need more support. And I am hopeful that this union for our school can be a step in the right direction to give teachers the support that they need.
CONTRIBUTORS
Nicole Barraza is a fourth-grade teacher at Citizens of the World Charter Silver Lake Elementary. She has been with Citizens of the World Charter for two years and has been teaching for seven years.
Marin Hodges is an eighth-grade math teacher at Citizens of the World Charter School Silver Lake. She has been with the organization for two years.
Sara Wexler is a member of UAW Local 2710 and a PhD student at Columbia University.
Nicole Barraza is a fourth-grade teacher at Citizens of the World Charter Silver Lake Elementary. She has been with Citizens of the World Charter for two years and has been teaching for seven years.
Marin Hodges is an eighth-grade math teacher at Citizens of the World Charter School Silver Lake. She has been with the organization for two years.
Sara Wexler is a member of UAW Local 2710 and a PhD student at Columbia University.
