SNC-Lavalin's services in high demand amid clean energy transition: CEO

Iva Poshnjari, The Canadian Press

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SNC-Lavalin Group Inc. beat analyst expectations in its first-quarter results and the engineering giant’s CEO attributes the strength to its clean energy transition.
 
Speaking with BNN Bloomberg’s Amber Kanwar on Tuesday, Ian Edwards, president and chief executive officer of SNC-Lavalin, said the resurgence in nuclear power and need for clean energy infrastructure gas brought government contracts back to the company. 
 
“Where we’ve positioned this company, in the U.S., the U.K. and Canada — these country’s are heavily investing in the renewal of aging infrastructure, investing into infrastructure that commits to a clean energy future and also a clean energy transformation,” he said. 
 
He added that SNC-Lavalin has divested out of oil and gas, and has also put most of the lump sum construction it was used to servicing behind it — making room for its new business model to focus on projects that will aid the world in the production of clean energy. 
 
As a result of the new strategy, the company posted $2.02 billion in revenue for the quarter, up from the $1.89 billion from the same time last year. 
 
Edwards noted because it is government contracts fuelling SNC’s business, he remains optimistic about future growth despite an uncertain economic landscape. 
 
“We are in nuclear, we are in the renewable space, we provide services to all of our customers and governments in all of those core geographies and we see very, very, strong demand for the services that we sell,” he added. 
 
As the business expands, he anticipates it will generate free cash flow by next year, at which point conversations about mergers and acquisitions are likely to begin. This will result in the company generating both organic and inorganic growth, he added. 
 
“We see a predictable future ahead from our engineering services business,” Edwards stated. 

WSP Global doubles down on green-

tinted expansion

Christopher Reynolds, The Canadian Press

WSP Global continued its years-long expansion this year, acquiring companies and securing contracts with an eye to the growing market for green projects.

Since late January, the engineering firm has completed three more acquisitions in Australia, Switzerland and Quebec, adding 900-plus employees to the payroll.

A fourth pending purchase of Australian engineering outfit Calibre will boost its headcount by another 800 and entrench WSP's prospects as a player in mine rehabilitation, said CEO Alexandre L'Heureux.

"It's built on the 2021 acquisition of Golder" — a 7,000-employee environmental consulting firm based in Toronto — "and aims to further position WSP as a leader in the mining industry's green transition in Australia and across the globe," L'Heureux told analysts on a conference call Thursday.

A global shift toward renewable energy over the next two decades will foster growing reliance on critical minerals as well as a push toward decarbonization in mining, boosting that sector's potential for WSP, he added.

The Montreal-based company is also part of a consortium selected last month to build the $4.9-billion first phase of Calgary's Green Line, a light-rail transit system comprising the largest infrastructure project in the city's history.

WSP has closed at least seven acquisition deals in the past 12 months — including the 35,000-strong British environment and infrastructure business of John Wood Group — and more than 120 since 2006.

Once a boutique firm called Genivar, the 64-year-old company has more than doubled its head count over the past decade, swelling to about 67,100 employees, including an additional 10,900 in 2022.

In its latest quarter, WSP boosted net earnings 18.4 per cent to $112.5 million from $95 million a year earlier. Revenues for the quarter ended April 1 rose nearly 29 per cent to $3.5 billion from $2.7 billion.

However, WSP's rosy financial outlook includes a couple clouds, according to one analyst.

"The quarter was definitely stronger than expected. But organic growth in the backlog was quite low. And you did maintain guidance, which does imply a slowdown in organic growth for the remainder of the year," Yuri Lynk of Canaccord Genuity told the chief executive.

L'Heureux replied that if two recent contracts, including the Green Line LRT, had been included in the quarterly results, the backlog within Canada would have reached double-digit growth rather than falling three per cent.

"So actually I'm not worried at this point at all ... It's more timing than anything," he said.

“We have 2,000 live projects at the moment, so you’ve got to look at the margin evolution over a longer period than 90 days," he added, referring to the adjusted earnings margin of 15.5 per cent, which remained flat year over year.

The engineering outfit has projected revenue growth of 19 per cent this year to between $10 billion and $10.6 billion. It has also forecasted an 18 per cent jump in adjusted earnings.

This report by The Canadian Press was first published May 11, 2023.

Reported Lassonde bid for Teck coal could thwart Glencore: analyst

The Canadian Press

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A mining analyst says an apparent effort by industry veteran Pierre Lassonde to buy Teck Resources' coal business could disrupt Glencore's push to take over the Canadian firm.

National Bank analyst Shane Nagle says the effort by a consortium led Lassonde, as reported in the Globe and Mail, could greatly reduce regulatory uncertainty for Teck and may thwart Glencore's attempt to acquire Teck's portfolio.

Nagle says in a note that Lassonde, co-founder and chair emeritus of Franco-Nevada Corp., has long been a critic of foreign takeovers of Canadian mining companies and has previously supported Teck's planned coal spinout. 

Teck has been pushing back against efforts by Glencore to take over the company, but the future of the Vancouver-based company is unclear after it was forced to abandon its own restructuring plan in late April when it didn't secure enough shareholder support.

The federal government has emphasized the importance of Teck with Prime Minister Trudeau noting any proposed deal from Glencore would face a "rigorous" review, while Industry Minister François-Philippe Champagne has said the government likes Teck as a Canadian company.

Teck said in a statement that it does not comment on market rumours or speculation. Lassonde could not be reached for comment. 

This report by The Canadian Press was first published May 9, 2023.

Real estate credit risk looms over Canadian banks’ profit picture

Mathieu Dion, Bloomberg News

Canada’s largest banks could see their profits reduced by nine per cent next year if the commercial real estate downturn is similar to one seen during the global financial crisis, according to analysis by National Bank of Canada.

Commercial property represents about 10 per cent of the loan portfolios of Canada’s six largest banks, surpassed only by residential mortgages. In a 2008-style scenario, that exposure could force them to set aside about $6.3 billion in provisions for credit losses to the commercial real state sector, analyst Gabriel Dechaine calculated. 

“Office exposures are the primary source of investor concerns,” Dechaine wrote, since occupancy rates are hovering around 50 per cent as many workers continue to spend large amounts of time at home. Gross impaired loans on commercial property are already on the rise — jumping by 8 basis points to 0.41 per cent during the fiscal first quarter ended Jan. 31, the analyst said. 

Dechaine built two scenarios to assess the potential impact on bank profits. Worse than the 2008 scenario would be a depression similar to the one that struck Canadian real estate markets in the early 1990s. That would send impaired loans soaring into the tens of billions, chopping 26 per cent off next year’s earnings for the six biggest banks.  

“While we argue that commercial real estate-related credit risks is lower on Canadian bank balance sheets, we also acknowledge that the mechanics of provision accounting could result in greater earnings volatility for the Big Six in a downturn scenario,” said Dechaine. Even in a 1990s scenario, banks’ capital ratios would stay above the minimum regulatory level, “or close enough,” he said. 

Royal Bank of Canada and Toronto-Dominion Bank have the largest commercial real estate loan portfolios among Canada’s six largest lenders, while smaller Canadian Imperial Bank of Commerce and National Bank have the largest exposure as a percentage of their capital.  

High costs putting farming out of reach for young people, affecting all Canadians

Jacob Serebrin, The Canadian Press

When Myriam Landry started raising goats for their meat in 2018, she started small — because she had to.

She opened Chèvrerie aux Volets Verts, in St-Esprit, Que., with two goats; she couldn't afford a large herd and chose animals small enough that she could handle on her own while pregnant with her third child.

"I should have started bigger … but then I would have needed more money, which I didn't have," Landry, 33, said in a recent interview from her farm 50 kilometres north of Montreal. 

"It's really hard for young people to start … I don't even have land, I don't have tractors, even my goats (I paid for) on loans."

The rising cost of land is making it harder than ever for young farmers to enter the business. And those barriers come at a time when a growing number of older farmers are planning to leave the industry. Organizations promoting farm succession worry that if young people are unable to enter the industry, only the largest companies will endure, reducing the diversity of crops and livestock and widening the gap between Canadians and their sources of food.

"The main challenge right now is really the cost of agricultural land," said Benoît Curé, co-ordinator of ARTERRE, a program that pairs aspiring farmers with landowners and farmers planning to retire.

Curé said multiple factors are contributing to rising prices, including real estate speculation — especially near Montreal suburbs — and strong competition for the best soil in a province where only around two per cent of the land is suitable for farming.

Last year, the price of agricultural land rose by 10 per cent, which isn't unusual, he said in a recent interview. "Over the last 10 years, we've had annual increases of about six to 10 per cent." The average dairy farm in Quebec is now valued at almost $5 million, he said, almost double what it was in 2011. 

With 20 per cent down payments usually expected for farm purchases, "you have to almost be a millionaire before starting your agricultural business," Curé said. If young people can't afford to get into farming, then most rural communities risk being left with two or three large farms, he lamented.

Landry, like more than half of the aspiring farmers who have worked with ARTERRE, is renting her space. Her small operation is located on a former dairy farm that's now used for hay and cereal crops. Her farm has now grown to 40 female goats and a handful of males for breeding. There's enough space in her barn for 60 females, she said, but she has enough demand to support 100. 

And while starting small has allowed her to open a farm, it has also come with its own challenges. Goat meat, she said, is uncommon in Quebec, and financial institutions are hesitant to lend to money for an operation they aren't familiar with. 

Lenders, she said, "don't want to finance it, because they don't know it, and that makes it really hard."

Farming has always been a capital-intensive industry — with high costs for land, equipment and inputs — but prices across Canada have risen above the revenue that can be generated from that land, said Jean-Philippe Gervais, the chief economist of Farm Credit Canada, a Crown corporation that lends to farmers.

"The relationship between the price of the land and the revenue that can be expected from the land — that ratio is the highest we've ever seen," Gervais said in a recent interview. "So we're really at prices that are the highest we've ever seen, not just in absolute value in dollars per hectare, but also relative to what can be generated in income."

It's now rare for farmers to turn a profit from land they buy just by farming it, he said, adding that most farmers only make their money back when they sell. Large, established farms can fund the purchase of more land from the revenue generated on land that's already been paid for, he added.

But even large farms are challenged by high costs. A survey of more than 3,600 farmers released last month by Quebec's farmers association found that 11 per cent are thinking about closing over the coming year. The Union des producteurs agricoles found that costs on Quebec farms rose by an average of 17.3 per cent in 2022 while revenues rose by an average of 14.7 per cent.

A report released in early April by RBC found that 40 per cent of Canadian farm operators planned to retire over the next decade and that 66 per cent didn't have a succession plan. 

Julie Bissonnette, the president of an organization that represents young Quebec farmers and promotes farm succession, says there are many young people interested in agriculture.

"Sometimes you hear there's no one to take over, but it's not true, there are a lot, but we need to make sure they're able to set up," Bissonnette, with the Fédération de la relève agricole du Québec, said in a recent interview. "It's so much money."

Urban sprawl and the influx of people moving to rural areas to work remotely is putting increased pressure on Quebec's arable land, Bissonnette said.

Landry, meanwhile, said she'd like to see more small-time farmers because they tend to build close relationships with local residents. 

"We need to reconnect the public to what they do three times a day, which is eat," she said. "Know where your food is coming from. If you can't grow it yourself, find someone who does it the way you would do it." 

This report by The Canadian Press was first published May 7, 2023. 

Adidas to sell Yeezy shoes and donate proceeds months after Kanye West split

Wyatte Grantham-philips, The Associated Press

After months wrestling over the fate of millions of unsold Yeezy shoes, Adidas has decided to sell a portion of its remaining inventory and donate the proceeds to charitable organizations, CEO of the German sportbrand Bjørn Gulden said Thursday.

Adidas cut ties with Ye, the rapper formerly known as Kanye West, in late October, following his antisemitic comments on social media and in interviews. As a result, the fate of 1.2 billion euros (US$1.3 billion) worth of the unsold Yeezys, a lucrative sneaker line launched with Ye, was unknown.

At Adidas' annual shareholders meeting, Gulden said the company had spent months trying to find solutions. The CEO also added that Adidas spoke to NGOs and organizations that were harmed by Ye's comments and actions.

“Burning those shoes cannot be the solution,” Gulden said, noting that Adidas was going to try to sell part of the remaining Yeezy inventory and “donate money to the organizations that help us and were harmed by what Ye said.”

Exact details of this plan — including how many shoes will be sold and the timeline of selling them — remain unknown. Gulden said the company will provide updates as they moves forward.

The move comes as Adidas is trying to stage a comeback and move beyond the Yeezy partnership. Cutting ties with Ye has cost Adidas hundreds of millions of dollars — with the company taking a loss of 600 million euros (US$655 million) in sales for the last three months of 2022, helping drive the company to a quarterly net loss of 513 million euros.

Adidas reported 400 million euros (US$441 million) in lost sales at the start of 2023, the company announced last week.

Net sales declined 1 per cent in the first quarter, to 5.27 billion euros, and would have risen 9 per cent with the Yeezy line, the company said. It reported a net loss of 24 million euros, a plunge from a profit of 310 million euros in the same period a year ago.

Operating profit, which excludes some items like taxes, was down to 60 million euros from 437 million euros a year earlier.

Meanwhile, Adidas is also facing a class-action lawsuit from investors who allege the company knew about offensive remarks and harmful behavior from Ye, years before terminating its pact with him. Adidas has pushed back on the allegations made in the lawsuit.

Still, Gulden reminded investors that the nine-year partnership Adidas and Ye was “sensational."

While he noted that Ye is a difficult person, “he's the most creative person in our industry,” Gulden said. “He created a model with Adidas that was sought after around the world.” But he added, “We lost that in a month."

AP Business Writer David McHugh in Frankfurt, Germany, and AP Retail Writer Anne D'Innocenzio in New York contributed to this report.

Hudson's Bay cutting 250 corporate jobs amid efforts to 'flatten' company

Brett Bundale, The Canadian Press

Hudson's Bay is laying off another 250 workers, the second round of cutbacks this year, the company said Tuesday, bringing the total number of employees laid off this year to about 500.

The Canadian retail arm of Hudson's Bay Co. said the layoffs are in corporate roles. None of the 2023 job losses have affected retail workers at Hudson's Bay's 84 department stores across Canada.

"As the retail sector continues to face headwinds, we are taking additional steps to flatten the organization and streamline operations," Hudson's Bay spokeswoman Tiffany Bourre said in a statement.

Economic pressures in the retail industry have continued longer than expected, making the second round of job losses this year necessary, she said.

"In January, we worked hard to minimize the impacts to our associates with the lens that macro pressures would ease," Bourre said. "However, they have persisted longer than we had hoped, which has made these changes necessary."

The company is committed to fairness and respect as it supports employees impacted by the layoff, she added.

In late January, Hudson's Bay said it was laying off about 250 workers.

At the time, the retailer said the changes were needed as the retail sector navigated "significant external pressures."

In January 2021, Hudson's Bay permanently laid off about 600 workers in Canada due to extended lockdowns that shuttered many of the retailer’s stores across the country for several months. Some had been on had been on a temporary layoff since April 2020.

This report by The Canadian Press was first published May 9, 2023.

Canadians still pessimistic on economy, but outlook improving: Report

Holly McKenzie-Sutter, BNN Bloomberg

Canadians’ views on the economy and their personal finances are improving but still pessimistic overall, according to a monthly snapshot of consumer sentiment.

The Canadian Maru Household Outlook Index for May was at 85, up two points from April’s low of 83. Last month’s figure was the lowest since Maru’s monthly overview of Canadian consumers’ 60-day financial and economic outlook began tracking in April 2021.

“The question is whether the current upswing is a burst or just a bubble,” a report on the findings said, noting that sentiment until now had been increasingly negative since December.

The report noted that 12 of the 16 measures assessed for the index have moved upwards.

The index looks at topics related to the economy, personal finance, purchasing power and financial challenges. Slightly more positive views on the economy drove most of this month’s increase.

More surveyed Canadians said they believe the national economy will improve over the next 60 days, up to 41 per cent from 35 per cent a month earlier, though a majority still said they don’t believe the improvement will happen soon.

There was also a slight increase in sentiment that the local economy will improve, up six percentage points to 42 per cent, while 58 per cent of people remained pessimistic.

More Canadians also said they believe the economy is headed in the right direction, up five percentage points to 39 per cent. That was the highest level of positivity since May 2022, though a majority of people still felt the economy was headed the wrong way.

There was an increase in Canadians who said they plan to invest in the financial markets, up to 32 per cent from 27 per cent.

The biggest negative drag on the index was the larger cohort of people who said they are not able to put away money for retirement, up to 56 per cent from 53 a month earlier.

Other personal finance indicators fared better. Fewer Canadians reported worsening financial positions, with 10 per cent of people saying their position improved and 26 per cent said they were worse off.

Fewer people also reported being worried about losing their jobs, but more were concerned about the possibility of a loan or mortgage default.

METHODOLOGY

These are some of the findings from a study released by Maru Public Opinion undertaken by its sample and data collection experts at Maru/Blue on April 28 to May 1, 2023, among a random selection of 1,508 Canadian adults who are Maru Voice Canada online panelists.

The results have been weighted by education, age, gender, and region (and, in Quebec, language) to match the population according to Census data which ensures the sample is representative of the entire adult population of Canada. Discrepancies in or between totals when compared to the data tables are due to rounding.

Riverbank erosion prompts Wisconsin band to ask for emergency shutdown of Line 5

The Canadian Press

An Indigenous band is asking a Wisconsin judge to order an emergency shutdown of Line 5 pipeline. The Bad River Band of the Lake Superior Chippewa says ongoing spring flooding risks exposing and rupturing the pipeline on its territorial land. (THE CANADIAN PRESS/AP, Detroit News - Dale G Young)

Heavy spring flooding has made Line 5 an "imminent threat" to Lake Superior and a key Indigenous watershed, lawyers argued Tuesday in an emergency motion to shut down the controversial cross-border pipeline. 

Lawyers for the Bad River Band of the Lake Superior Chippewa filed their emergency motion Tuesday and asked District Court Judge William Conley to make a decision on it before the end of the week. 

The motion comes after a joint status report by both the band and the pipeline's owner, Enbridge Inc., acknowledged extensive erosion last month that has brought the edges of the Bad River ever closer to the pipeline. 

That erosion has only continued with "alarming rapidity" in recent days, the motion says, with the river less than five metres away in several spots — and just 3.5 metres away in one specific area.

"Erosion continues to progress … and important factors suggest that further bank loss could be significant, resulting in the exposure and rupture of the pipeline," it reads.

"These circumstances present an imminent threat to the Bad River watershed and Lake Superior, and hence to the rights of the band and the public, and they warrant immediate action by this court." 

The band has been in court with Alberta energy giant Enbridge since 2019 in an effort to compel the pipeline's owner and operator to reroute Line 5 around its traditional territory.

Enbridge has already agreed to do so, and that work is well underway. The dispute now revolves around whether the company should be required to shut down and purge the section of line on Bad River land in the meantime. 

Late last year, Conley — having already rejected calls to shut down the pipeline immediately — ordered both parties to submit contingency plans in the event the risk of a rupture grew too great.

Neither plan was triggered by the flooding, which began April 11 after an abrupt spring melt and persisted for days, worsened by heavy rains, until the floodwaters finally receded fully on April 23, the report says.

Conley has already indicated that he's reluctant to shut the pipeline down wholesale, citing the potential economic impact in both Canada and the U.S. 

The motion suggests Bad River's lawyers believe the current circumstances might change his mind. 

"The band is sensitive to the court's economic concerns about enjoining the pipeline," it reads. 

"The far graver threat at present is of a rupture that not only would shut down Line 5 but would devastate the Bad River watershed and Lake Superior in the process."

Environmental concerns about Line 5 have long been top of mind in Wisconsin, where the pipeline runs directly through the Bad River Reservation, more than 500 square kilometres of pristine wetlands, streams and wilderness.

Enbridge has plans for a 66-kilometre detour of Line 5 around the reservation, which are already more than two years along.

Late last month, the United Nations Permanent Forum on Indigenous Issues, a UN advisory body, recommended that Canada rescind its support for the pipeline, citing the potential risk of a disaster in the Great Lakes.

The forum called Line 5 "a real and credible threat to the treaty-protected fishing rights of Indigenous Peoples in the United States and Canada."

Line 5 is also under legal siege in neighbouring Michigan, where the state wants the line shut down for fear of a disaster in the Straits of Mackinac, the ecologically delicate area where it crosses beneath the Great Lakes.

Business groups and chambers of commerce on both sides of the border, provincial governments and Ottawa have all rallied behind Enbridge in its effort to portray Line 5's survival as a mission-critical matter of continental energy security.

Allies have argued in court filings as well as public forums that Line 5 is a vital source of energy for several Midwestern states and an essential link for Canadian refineries that fuel some of Canada's busiest airports.

This report by The Canadian Press was first published May 9, 2023.

Trudeau’s oil policy is too harsh for Alberta’s left-leaning contender

Brian Platt and Robert Tuttle, Bloomberg News

The woman who’s looking to reclaim power in Canada’s energy heartland is pushing back against Prime Minister Justin Trudeau’s targets for cleaning up the oil and gas industry.

Rachel Notley, who was the center-left premier of Alberta from 2015 to 2019 and is running for the job again, said Trudeau’s plan for cutting the sector’s emissions by more than 40 per cent by the end of decade is too onerous. Her stance mirrors that of the country’s largest crude producers — and it’s also one that may be a political necessity as her New Democratic Party battles for votes in a province where oil is king and the prime minister is deeply unpopular.

“I don’t believe that the current drafted emissions caps that we’ve seen are realistic,” Notley said in an interview with Bloomberg News. “If we don’t get down to work and come up with a more practical cap, we are not going to be successful in mapping out a process that will get us there.”

Trudeau’s government has promised to limit emissions in the energy sector to ensure Canada meets its climate targets, but hasn’t yet chosen a mechanism for doing so. His government published a plan last year that modeled a 42 per cent cut in oil and gas sector emissions by 2030, which oil executives have said isn’t possible without slashing output. More draft regulations are expected to be released within weeks.

Relations between the federal government and Alberta — whose nearly 4 million barrels of daily oil output makes Canada the world’s fourth-largest crude producer — are a perennial flashpoint in local politics. Notley’s 2015 victory was a rare win in a traditionally conservative province. She’s looking to defeat the United Conservative Party, currently led by Danielle Smith, in an election set for May 29.

Although Notley is generally much more aligned with Trudeau’s environmental agenda than Smith, she said the federal government is trying to move too fast on cutting oil-sector emissions. The vast majority of these emissions in Canada come from Alberta’s oil sands, which is among the world’s most carbon-intensive crude sources.

“Using aspirational numbers to drive practical policy is not a recipe for success,” Notley said. “The key is making sure that what we put in place is practical and achievable, and it doesn’t become so oppressive that we find ourselves shutting in production.”

Notley said she doesn’t oppose a cap in principle, but she declined to provide her own emissions target, saying she’d consult with experts and industry on the matter.

“We’re not going to be unambitious,” she said. “But we are going to be realistic, and we’re going to make sure that the industry is able to continue to flourish.”

Polls suggest the race between Notley and Smith is very tight. A recent Leger survey found the New Democrats had a two-point lead over the United Conservatives, while another poll by Ipsos found Smith’s party was up by four points.

Notley is expected to sweep much of Alberta’s capital city of Edmonton, while Smith is dominant in the smaller population centers and rural areas. The election will likely come down to who wins the most districts in Calgary — where many of Canada’s energy companies are headquartered.

Notley argued that in the bigger picture, Canada’s environmental policy needs input from Alberta, and that has been prevented by the hostility between Smith’s United Conservatives and Trudeau’s Liberal Party.

“Both Alberta and Canada do best when energy policy is crafted, quite frankly, by Alberta,” she said. “So we want to be at the table, we want to be driving the conversation, and we want to be coming up with solutions that ultimately drive investment and grow our markets.”

Another of Trudeau’s signature environmental policies is a carbon tax on consumer fuels, which kicks in if a province doesn’t have an equivalent carbon price of its own. Notley said she would leave that as a federal tax, instead of replacing it with a made-in-Alberta version.

‘GET MORE MONEY’

To help push the oil sector to decarbonize, Trudeau has also introduced tax credits to defray the capital costs of building carbon capture systems. The credits are worth up to $12.4 billion over the next 10 years, federal officials estimate.

Even more public money for carbon capture might be necessary to compete with the lucrative production tax credits in the US Inflation Reduction Act, Notley said. She declined to say if she would commit the provincial government to providing the funds.

“It really is a matter still for negotiations,” she said. “My first goal will be to get more money out of the federal government.”

Yet another federal policy that’s been the source of controversy in Alberta is an impending requirement that electricity grids be made net-zero emissions by 2035.

Notley said Alberta can achieve the milestone at a reasonable cost if she’s elected premier and that trillions of dollars of global investment in renewable energy projects are coming over the next decade.

“It would be utterly ridiculous for Alberta to not be at the table trying to attract some of that,” she said. “So that is going to require some smart government policy, that’s going to require some incentives.”